i still remember the first time i watched this and saw Thrall channel fire, that he would go on to become an even more conflicted character than he already was. He dishonored himself big time by using magic in the tradition duel.
When the Warcraft movie premiered, I distinctly remember people sitting near me saying aloud, "He's a cheater just like Thrall" when Gul'dan used fel during a Mok'gorah.
@@papapalps2415 it really is though. Unarmed or the weapons brought into the fight. Just like Gul’Dan dishonorably killed Durotan and Sylvanas dishonorably killed Saurfang
@@animathehallowed1380 It isn't. The movie isn't canon (the...the fact I need to even state this is a truly astonishing indicator of just how utterly vapid most people who utilize the Internet are), and Sylvanas didn't cheat by using magic, either; she literally does so constantly throughout their fight (the daggers being enhanced being the most obvious, as well as whatever strength augmentation mumbo jumbo she has going on). She 'lost' the fight because she -is a drooling poorly written 'tard- doesn't really care about Azeroth or keeping up appearances by that point, and makes it very clear verbally. There are a myriad number of examples of magic being utilized in Mak'gora with nothing being noted to be amiss (most hilariously the literal ENTIRE OTHER Mak'gora Garrosh and Thrall had. UH-OH). Here's a hint; Mak'gora -is a thinly concealed plot device- doesn't HAVE a standardized ruleset. The rules vary from case to case, based upon what is agreed upon mutually by the combatants beforehand. Seeing how Thrall and Garrosh seemingly never established any rules to begin with, and that Garrosh also never brought up it being TEH DISHONOUWUABLE during or after, the conclusion should be obvious.
Cool beans my guy. I stopped playing during this expansion as the game had become complete ass and FarmVille with the garrison bullshit. So, ima go raise my child now and go have sex with my wife later this evening and you have fun vehemently explaining things from crap Blizzard. Toodles.
Some of the comments here blame Thrall for the actions of Garrosh, but that's not the truth. It's like the bank robber claiming that society was to blame for him robbing banks. Thrall did screw up in picking such an obviously deranged orc for the position, but I remember at the time the justification was "The Horde loves Garrosh." And unfortunately that's sometimes how political decisions work. In Azeroth, just as in the real world, the opinions of the populace matter. Thrall couldn't just name anyone he liked as warchief. The Horde had to be willing to follow, and they were willing to follow Garrosh. Thrall seems to just have assumed that everything would work out while he went off and did his Shaman thing, that the Horde wouldn't immediately start escalating the war that started at the Wrathgate. And once someone is in power they often can't be pried off the throne by anything short of civil war. For Garrosh to blame Thrall is just him trying to cast blame everywhere except himself. Garrosh is to blame. HE made the decision to butcher his way through Ashenvale. HE made the decision to bomb Theramore using a WMD after his forces had already pushed the retreating Alliance to the heart of the town. HE made the decision to invade Pandaria, and to use the power of an Old God to try and win. HE chose to travel back in time and alter the history of Draenor, creating an alternate timeline for the sole purpose of invading Azeroth... and he fully supported the Iron Horde's attempt at genocide. All of it was on him. _All of it._ Claiming the elements care about an honor duel is just bad writing. They don't. I suspect the reason that Thrall can't use the elements is because he's holding himself back. He believes he cheated, even though he didn't. Magic isn't forbidden in a mak'gora. As for me, my main is a Draenei Paladin. My attitude towards Thrall's battle with Garrosh was "It's time you take out the trash, Thrall. This is long overdue. Your fault was in not challenging this insane butcher long ago."
@@Evil0ttothank you for pointing this all out its funny how thrall uses a little bit of magic and everyone else freaks out saying garrosh was a good guy because of that moment but he definitely wasn't. Also your reasoning for your character is great.
Watching this almost a decade on makes me realize how much potential WoD had. Garrosh was such a good character. I really wish Thrall would've gotten what he deserved.
Meh. Garrosh was used up as a villain and deserved to get his head caved in. When someone's plan involves using time travel to create an army then they're done, because that's the sort of idea a comic book supervillain would come up with.
Well, being being a murderous maniac that literally turned himself into an eldritch abomination/actively using literal Old God mumbo-jumbo (because he's insane), but I mean, pfft, 'cheating' in a fight to the death? Irredeemable, truly.
Nope. Magic isn't forbidden, despite a lot of the people in these comments claiming that it is. It was forbidden only in the Warcraft movie... which isn't canon to the game.
To everyone saying Thrall cheated, he didn't. Magic isn't forbidden unless both parties agree beforehand. It's a contest of strength, but that doesn't mean just physical strength.
he did cheat, its one weapon for gods sake, he had the doomhammer which is one of the most powerfull weapons a giant ass chestplate and the audacity to cast magic. Garrosh could´ve killed thrall easily, he was on top of him but he waited for him to stand up and fight. Im not a garrosh stan, I like thrall and hell I even main alliance, but he defintly cheated, no doubt in my mind.
@@Evil0tto I´ve never said that magic was illegal. But you need to choose A weapon not two. You can see how Garrosh was surprised of the use of his magic. Thrall came as a warrior, he lost, then he fought like a shaman. If magic was his first weapon of choice, why didnt he use it in the first place? It was his last resort. It was unhonorful, while garrosh fought honorful. Even though he was on top of thrall punching the shit out of him. No he stood up and waited for thrall to get up.
@@Domwyn Again, there's no such requirement. It's a test of strength, and whatever strength the user has is fine. Garrosh had nothing _except_ brute force, while Thrall had his big-ass hammer and magic. The rule is that you can't pick up a lost weapon, but there's nothing to say you only have to use one weapon. Saurfang uses two weapons from the start of his duel with Windrunner. And when he loses his axe he splits Shalamayne into two swords and continues the duel after Windrunner pauses to taunt him.
If you think 'cheating in a duel to the death to beat a murderous tyrannical maniac' is actually some OMGFUL morally 'wrong' thing to do, even if the idea was true (it isn't; magic isn't forbidden, and Mak'Gora doesn't even have standardized rules to begin with), I have a piece of beachfront property in Arizona I want to sell you.
Garrosh is definetely not honorable Will stop at nothing to reach his goal even kill innocent lives honor he has not he will not no about honor. He only thinks of himself arrogance and hatred has filled his heart no place for tranquility.
Garrosh literally did nothing wrong. Blizzard even admitted they fucked up his writing by saying in other timelines he was the greatest warchief who ever lived.
@@Evil0tto well he did somethings wrong, but he did some things right. The nightelves basically cucked the horde and children were starving even before the cataclysm. The drought in durotar was so bad, even the Tauren in Mulgore expierenced no rain for weeks. Ogrimmar burned before the cataclysm and lots of villages got destroyed in the barrens and durotar after deathwings rampage. If garrosh hadn´t attacked ashenvale for ressources Varian might´ve invaded ogrimmar seeing them weak and beeing more logosh than varian, this isnt a far stretch. Especially with the peace treaty, which the horde broke.
@@Domwyn Garrosh nuked Theramore unprovoked. Varian wasn't interested in invading Orgrimmar, and didn't have the resources to do so anyway. Garrosh was a warmonger and a mass murderer, and even led an invasion from another dimension when his plans in Pandaria failed. When I was playing WoD my Alliance character's attitude toward the duel was "It's about fucking time you took out the trash, Thrall. You should never have put that animal in charge of the Horde."
@@Evil0tto First of all im for the alliance, garrosh was not a good pick for the warchief but, Varian could´ve and wanted to go to war with the horde. He hesitated because of his son and jaina, if graymane was his advisor earlier and his son wasnt so peace loving / jaina, Varian would´ve conquered Ogrimmar for sure. The Alliance were better off in the time frame after wotlk until the cataclysm, he still had to control logosh in him and he hates orcs. He was a prisioner, the horde destroyed his home back in the first war and had to flee. It would´ve been weird if he didnt want to go to war. Furthermore Durotar was fucked, thrall was gone, and the bombing of theramore, was way later in the middle of the war between the alliance and the horde in cata. Look at tol barad, ashenvale etc.
@@DomwynEven if this idea was true (it isn't, magic isn't forbidden in Mak'gora usually, which doesnt even have a standard ruleset to begin with), if your personal moral system actually, unironically ranks 'cheating in a duel to the death to put down a literal tyrannical overlord' as even vaguely notable relative to the moral good of 'putting down a blatantly evil tyrannical overlord', I'd seriously suggest you need to start re-evalauting how you view the world, because it's geniunely unhealthy.
Because the movie isn't the same universe as the game, it's an alternative setting. In the game universe magic has been used in every mak'gora where at least one fighter is a magic user.
@@DominionSorcerer It's one thing the movie definitely did better. Magic seems like a cheap way to win a duel of honour. What honour is there in killing your rival with anothers' power? Thrall gets his magic from the elementals.
@@FoolishPoppycockwhat honour is there in demanding a weaker opponent significantly weaken himself even further by forbidding him from wielding the powers that is his greatest strength?
@@DominionSorcerer Plenty. The honour is in relying on no one's strength but your own to defeat your opponent. There's nothing more Orcish than that. Thrall probably could have done it with good writing. Like, using his centered state of mind to triumph over Garrosh's angry, reckless one. Rather than just like... making Thrall use a magic ace in the hole and throwing out the idea of a fair fight. Meanwhile, there's not much honour in borrowing the power of spirits and elementals to win a duel that is between just you and someone else. But I suppose I can get behind the idea Thrall took that metaphorical honour bullet just to stop Garrosh's continued crimes. They seem to want to diminish his character what with his aversion to leadership, that's just how he's written I guess. Which is fair. It's pretty realistic for someone who's been through what Thrall has to just want to rest. Still better writing if there was a creative, badass and fair victory though. Like, even a moment where Thrall goes to use the elements, but is like... "no... I will fix this MYSELF!" and doomhammers all over Garrosh.
@@FoolishPoppycock which ignores just how honoured shamans and the elementals are in Orcish society. To demand someone weaker than you, who while not as skilled of a fighter, had the strength of will required to commune with the elementals, would be dishonourable. It would have never been a fair fight because Garrosh is the better fighter of the two - he's always been, that's why he was dominating their first Mak'gora too. But, curious there, why did no one say it was dishonourable of Thrall to use the elements in that fight?
Thrall cheated
Anikin vs Obi one wine😁
т
i still remember the first time i watched this and saw Thrall channel fire, that he would go on to become an even more conflicted character than he already was. He dishonored himself big time by using magic in the tradition duel.
So Thrall cheated in a Mak'gora, got it... ummm Guldan much? Guess your pop's death didn't teach you anything...
Garrosh should ve bought a trinket
When the Warcraft movie premiered, I distinctly remember people sitting near me saying aloud, "He's a cheater just like Thrall" when Gul'dan used fel during a Mok'gorah.
Thrall, you cheating b*%ch! 😂
Magic is not forbidden nor cheating.
@@papapalps2415 it really is though. Unarmed or the weapons brought into the fight. Just like Gul’Dan dishonorably killed Durotan and Sylvanas dishonorably killed Saurfang
@@animathehallowed1380 It isn't. The movie isn't canon (the...the fact I need to even state this is a truly astonishing indicator of just how utterly vapid most people who utilize the Internet are), and Sylvanas didn't cheat by using magic, either; she literally does so constantly throughout their fight (the daggers being enhanced being the most obvious, as well as whatever strength augmentation mumbo jumbo she has going on). She 'lost' the fight because she -is a drooling poorly written 'tard- doesn't really care about Azeroth or keeping up appearances by that point, and makes it very clear verbally. There are a myriad number of examples of magic being utilized in Mak'gora with nothing being noted to be amiss (most hilariously the literal ENTIRE OTHER Mak'gora Garrosh and Thrall had. UH-OH). Here's a hint; Mak'gora -is a thinly concealed plot device- doesn't HAVE a standardized ruleset. The rules vary from case to case, based upon what is agreed upon mutually by the combatants beforehand. Seeing how Thrall and Garrosh seemingly never established any rules to begin with, and that Garrosh also never brought up it being TEH DISHONOUWUABLE during or after, the conclusion should be obvious.
👍
Cool beans my guy. I stopped playing during this expansion as the game had become complete ass and FarmVille with the garrison bullshit. So, ima go raise my child now and go have sex with my wife later this evening and you have fun vehemently explaining things from crap Blizzard. Toodles.
Some of the comments here blame Thrall for the actions of Garrosh, but that's not the truth. It's like the bank robber claiming that society was to blame for him robbing banks. Thrall did screw up in picking such an obviously deranged orc for the position, but I remember at the time the justification was "The Horde loves Garrosh." And unfortunately that's sometimes how political decisions work. In Azeroth, just as in the real world, the opinions of the populace matter. Thrall couldn't just name anyone he liked as warchief. The Horde had to be willing to follow, and they were willing to follow Garrosh. Thrall seems to just have assumed that everything would work out while he went off and did his Shaman thing, that the Horde wouldn't immediately start escalating the war that started at the Wrathgate. And once someone is in power they often can't be pried off the throne by anything short of civil war. For Garrosh to blame Thrall is just him trying to cast blame everywhere except himself. Garrosh is to blame. HE made the decision to butcher his way through Ashenvale. HE made the decision to bomb Theramore using a WMD after his forces had already pushed the retreating Alliance to the heart of the town. HE made the decision to invade Pandaria, and to use the power of an Old God to try and win. HE chose to travel back in time and alter the history of Draenor, creating an alternate timeline for the sole purpose of invading Azeroth... and he fully supported the Iron Horde's attempt at genocide. All of it was on him. _All of it._ Claiming the elements care about an honor duel is just bad writing. They don't. I suspect the reason that Thrall can't use the elements is because he's holding himself back. He believes he cheated, even though he didn't. Magic isn't forbidden in a mak'gora. As for me, my main is a Draenei Paladin. My attitude towards Thrall's battle with Garrosh was "It's time you take out the trash, Thrall. This is long overdue. Your fault was in not challenging this insane butcher long ago."
@HansMoleman. I always love low-effort responses from the two digit IQ crowd.
@@Evil0ttothank you for pointing this all out its funny how thrall uses a little bit of magic and everyone else freaks out saying garrosh was a good guy because of that moment but he definitely wasn't. Also your reasoning for your character is great.
How did we go from Garrosh and Varian to what we have now.
remember garrosh did nothing wrong and thrall was the true villian
Watching this almost a decade on makes me realize how much potential WoD had. Garrosh was such a good character. I really wish Thrall would've gotten what he deserved.
Meh. Garrosh was used up as a villain and deserved to get his head caved in. When someone's plan involves using time travel to create an army then they're done, because that's the sort of idea a comic book supervillain would come up with.
...A happy family and life from the war? Yeah, I'd say Thrall got what he deserved, tbh.
Garrosh did nothing wrong
Well, being being a murderous maniac that literally turned himself into an eldritch abomination/actively using literal Old God mumbo-jumbo (because he's insane), but I mean, pfft, 'cheating' in a fight to the death? Irredeemable, truly.
Totem Totem dude , Chidori him 🫣 💀
Why did Thrall lose his powers after this? Surely its not the first time he has used the elements to kill.
because hes a fraud and weak, he manipulated the elements for selfish purposes
best in-game cinematic they’ve ever done. shame that nowadays they’re just used for long shot-reverse-shit dialogue sequences
Does blizzard hate all these characters? Made Thrall into a cheating wimp with this one.
Isnt magic forbidden in Mak'Gora? Thrall cheated
Nope. Magic isn't forbidden, despite a lot of the people in these comments claiming that it is. It was forbidden only in the Warcraft movie... which isn't canon to the game.
There is any SL expansion. No sanctum of domination. He is dead here, like a true warchief
What the fuck do you mean "spoilers" this is old content
I thought magic wasn’t showed In a makgorah
To everyone saying Thrall cheated, he didn't. Magic isn't forbidden unless both parties agree beforehand. It's a contest of strength, but that doesn't mean just physical strength.
he did cheat, its one weapon for gods sake, he had the doomhammer which is one of the most powerfull weapons a giant ass chestplate and the audacity to cast magic. Garrosh could´ve killed thrall easily, he was on top of him but he waited for him to stand up and fight. Im not a garrosh stan, I like thrall and hell I even main alliance, but he defintly cheated, no doubt in my mind.
@@Domwyn Cite your source. There's no rule that says "no magic." That's from the Warcraft movie, which isn't canon with the game.
@@Evil0tto I´ve never said that magic was illegal. But you need to choose A weapon not two. You can see how Garrosh was surprised of the use of his magic. Thrall came as a warrior, he lost, then he fought like a shaman. If magic was his first weapon of choice, why didnt he use it in the first place? It was his last resort. It was unhonorful, while garrosh fought honorful. Even though he was on top of thrall punching the shit out of him. No he stood up and waited for thrall to get up.
@@Domwyn Again, there's no such requirement. It's a test of strength, and whatever strength the user has is fine. Garrosh had nothing _except_ brute force, while Thrall had his big-ass hammer and magic. The rule is that you can't pick up a lost weapon, but there's nothing to say you only have to use one weapon. Saurfang uses two weapons from the start of his duel with Windrunner. And when he loses his axe he splits Shalamayne into two swords and continues the duel after Windrunner pauses to taunt him.
@@Evil0tto good point with saurfang
I do not rely on strength alone, Garrosh. My cheating magic is all around you!
If you think 'cheating in a duel to the death to beat a murderous tyrannical maniac' is actually some OMGFUL morally 'wrong' thing to do, even if the idea was true (it isn't; magic isn't forbidden, and Mak'Gora doesn't even have standardized rules to begin with), I have a piece of beachfront property in Arizona I want to sell you.
Garrosh is definetely not honorable Will stop at nothing to reach his goal even kill innocent lives honor he has not he will not no about honor. He only thinks of himself arrogance and hatred has filled his heart no place for tranquility.
Garrosh won the fist fight here.
GARROSH DID NOTHING WRONG
Garrosh literally did nothing wrong. Blizzard even admitted they fucked up his writing by saying in other timelines he was the greatest warchief who ever lived.
Garrosh literally did nothing right.
@@Evil0tto well he did somethings wrong, but he did some things right. The nightelves basically cucked the horde and children were starving even before the cataclysm. The drought in durotar was so bad, even the Tauren in Mulgore expierenced no rain for weeks. Ogrimmar burned before the cataclysm and lots of villages got destroyed in the barrens and durotar after deathwings rampage. If garrosh hadn´t attacked ashenvale for ressources Varian might´ve invaded ogrimmar seeing them weak and beeing more logosh than varian, this isnt a far stretch. Especially with the peace treaty, which the horde broke.
@@Domwyn Garrosh nuked Theramore unprovoked. Varian wasn't interested in invading Orgrimmar, and didn't have the resources to do so anyway. Garrosh was a warmonger and a mass murderer, and even led an invasion from another dimension when his plans in Pandaria failed. When I was playing WoD my Alliance character's attitude toward the duel was "It's about fucking time you took out the trash, Thrall. You should never have put that animal in charge of the Horde."
@@Evil0tto First of all im for the alliance, garrosh was not a good pick for the warchief but, Varian could´ve and wanted to go to war with the horde. He hesitated because of his son and jaina, if graymane was his advisor earlier and his son wasnt so peace loving / jaina, Varian would´ve conquered Ogrimmar for sure. The Alliance were better off in the time frame after wotlk until the cataclysm, he still had to control logosh in him and he hates orcs. He was a prisioner, the horde destroyed his home back in the first war and had to flee. It would´ve been weird if he didnt want to go to war. Furthermore Durotar was fucked, thrall was gone, and the bombing of theramore, was way later in the middle of the war between the alliance and the horde in cata. Look at tol barad, ashenvale etc.
@@Evil0tto lets just ignore the entire southern barrens and northwatch plot line
Thrall did nothing wrong. Fuck Garrosh.
well he cheated tho
@@DomwynEven if this idea was true (it isn't, magic isn't forbidden in Mak'gora usually, which doesnt even have a standard ruleset to begin with), if your personal moral system actually, unironically ranks 'cheating in a duel to the death to put down a literal tyrannical overlord' as even vaguely notable relative to the moral good of 'putting down a blatantly evil tyrannical overlord', I'd seriously suggest you need to start re-evalauting how you view the world, because it's geniunely unhealthy.
Skype lol
Garrosh did nothing wrong
Thrall clearly cheated!
Thrall knows no honor. Garrosh was a true warchief.
Thrall CHEATS!
Mag Korah Legal
Is this the new Avatar: The last Airbender trailer? I see a bald dude bending fire, earth and wind 🤔
I think that, Garrosh still appreciated Thrall. He just wanted to beat him, not kill him.
Thrall is a cheating bitch and should have died on that hill.
No
@@JonySmith-bb4gx Brilliant retort. Yes.
@@ephemispriest8069 how is it cheating ? And yes that's the retort to the statement u made
@@JonySmith-bb4gx Because the fight is supposed to be unarmored and with only one weapon. He broke the rules. Thus he cheated.
@@ephemispriest8069 he never relied on just war mongering killer instinct .. He fought with his best technique just like hellscream .
Neither Garrosh nor Thrall did anything wrong. Just disagreed about the essence of the Horde.
1 killed and the other saved
Thrall cheated.
Thrall cheated
This game is dead
Draenor is FREEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!
But when Gul´dan used magic against Durotan everyone booed him :D What a joke.
Thrall modified the rules when he was Warchief. Now shamans can fight in the Mokgora.
I like how thrall shaved his head purely to match metzen's bald head
Thrall has no honor
Seeing Yriel being badass reminds me how much I hate Blizzard for ruining Heros of the Storm.
*music starts* War....war never changes.
*Thrall cheated* No magic or armor allowed in Magkora
This isn't and never has been a thing. Mak'gora doesn't have a standard ruleset.
When Gul'Dan used magic to win in his Mak'gora with Durotan, he was reviled as a cheater. Why does no one treat Thrall by the same standard?
Because the movie isn't the same universe as the game, it's an alternative setting. In the game universe magic has been used in every mak'gora where at least one fighter is a magic user.
@@DominionSorcerer It's one thing the movie definitely did better. Magic seems like a cheap way to win a duel of honour. What honour is there in killing your rival with anothers' power? Thrall gets his magic from the elementals.
@@FoolishPoppycockwhat honour is there in demanding a weaker opponent significantly weaken himself even further by forbidding him from wielding the powers that is his greatest strength?
@@DominionSorcerer Plenty. The honour is in relying on no one's strength but your own to defeat your opponent. There's nothing more Orcish than that. Thrall probably could have done it with good writing. Like, using his centered state of mind to triumph over Garrosh's angry, reckless one. Rather than just like... making Thrall use a magic ace in the hole and throwing out the idea of a fair fight. Meanwhile, there's not much honour in borrowing the power of spirits and elementals to win a duel that is between just you and someone else. But I suppose I can get behind the idea Thrall took that metaphorical honour bullet just to stop Garrosh's continued crimes. They seem to want to diminish his character what with his aversion to leadership, that's just how he's written I guess. Which is fair. It's pretty realistic for someone who's been through what Thrall has to just want to rest. Still better writing if there was a creative, badass and fair victory though. Like, even a moment where Thrall goes to use the elements, but is like... "no... I will fix this MYSELF!" and doomhammers all over Garrosh.
@@FoolishPoppycock which ignores just how honoured shamans and the elementals are in Orcish society. To demand someone weaker than you, who while not as skilled of a fighter, had the strength of will required to commune with the elementals, would be dishonourable. It would have never been a fair fight because Garrosh is the better fighter of the two - he's always been, that's why he was dominating their first Mak'gora too. But, curious there, why did no one say it was dishonourable of Thrall to use the elements in that fight?
Very sad.
THALL CHEATS!
Thrall cheats!